Topics

WBO - SOON: Pass-the-Hat to fund the Site


Peter P
 

Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX


Gary Mertl
 

I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA


Les Higgins
 

It is interesting that there are two groups? Why is that?  It seems that we should have a combined Willard Owners Group. I would consider an annual fee or the selling of Willard swag as a way to support the enterprise. It would be a shame to loose any archived data.
Les
W30 Searcher, Molly Dog
Stockton, Ca


On Sep 9, 2020, at 07:33, Gary Mertl via groups.io <gulliver32us@...> wrote:


I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA

--
Les H.

1973 Searcher, Molly Dog, Stockton,Ca 


Peter P
 

Les - I believe the second Group on WillardBoats.org was setup by Rick when we weren't sure what our future looked like when Yahoo shut down last year. Rick has done an amazing job of keeping WBO together these last couple of years.


Peter Pisciotta 
+1-408-772-1564 (WhatsApp/Text/Mobile)


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 10:37:41 AM EDT, Les Higgins via groups.io <almonhiggins@...> wrote:


It is interesting that there are two groups? Why is that?  It seems that we should have a combined Willard Owners Group. I would consider an annual fee or the selling of Willard swag as a way to support the enterprise. It would be a shame to loose any archived data.
Les
W30 Searcher, Molly Dog
Stockton, Ca


On Sep 9, 2020, at 07:33, Gary Mertl via groups.io <gulliver32us@...> wrote:


I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA

--
Les H.

1973 Searcher, Molly Dog, Stockton,Ca 


--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX


Sean Eamon Kennedy
 

Thank you Rick! We don’t say that enough, especially if we don’t get to get to see you at a rendezvous. 

I rather like groups.io. Having just one site on the WillardBoats.org would be nice, but I suspect it would be a lot of work to get it up to the same functionality as groups.io. 

What do you all think of formalizing the group somewhat and having an annual membership fee that supports both groups.io and the willardboats.org sites. Any excess could be used to help subsidize the annual rendezvous. A bet $10/year would be plenty - too much if all 343 current groups.io members paid up!

We’d need to incorporate as a non-profit, but I’d be willing to help with that. 

I really do appreciate all the knowledge the group has and shares. Let’s keep it going. 



On Sep 9, 2020, at 8:03 AM, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Les - I believe the second Group on WillardBoats.org was setup by Rick when we weren't sure what our future looked like when Yahoo shut down last year. Rick has done an amazing job of keeping WBO together these last couple of years.


Peter Pisciotta 
+1-408-772-1564 (WhatsApp/Text/Mobile)


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 10:37:41 AM EDT, Les Higgins via groups.io <almonhiggins@...> wrote:


It is interesting that there are two groups? Why is that?  It seems that we should have a combined Willard Owners Group. I would consider an annual fee or the selling of Willard swag as a way to support the enterprise. It would be a shame to loose any archived data.
Les
W30 Searcher, Molly Dog
Stockton, Ca


On Sep 9, 2020, at 07:33, Gary Mertl via groups.io <gulliver32us@...> wrote:


I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA

--
Les H.

1973 Searcher, Molly Dog, Stockton,Ca 


--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Sean Eamon Kennedy
Vega Voyager “Moonlight”


chris gibbs
 

I'm in. there is a ton of value here.

On 2020-09-09 11:30, Sean Eamon Kennedy via groups.io wrote:
Thank you Rick! We don’t say that enough, especially if we don’t
get to get to see you at a rendezvous.
I rather like groups.io. Having just one site on the WillardBoats.org
would be nice, but I suspect it would be a lot of work to get it up to
the same functionality as groups.io.
What do you all think of formalizing the group somewhat and having an
annual membership fee that supports both groups.io and the
willardboats.org sites. Any excess could be used to help subsidize the
annual rendezvous. A bet $10/year would be plenty - too much if all
343 current groups.io members paid up!
We’d need to incorporate as a non-profit, but I’d be willing to
help with that.
I really do appreciate all the knowledge the group has and shares.
Let’s keep it going.

On Sep 9, 2020, at 8:03 AM, Peter P via groups.io
<pete_pisc=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Les - I believe the second Group on WillardBoats.org was setup by
Rick when we weren't sure what our future looked like when Yahoo
shut down last year. Rick has done an amazing job of keeping WBO
together these last couple of years.
Peter Pisciotta
+1-408-772-1564 (WhatsApp/Text/Mobile)
On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 10:37:41 AM EDT, Les Higgins via
groups.io <almonhiggins=icloud.com@groups.io> wrote:
It is interesting that there are two groups? Why is that? It seems
that we should have a combined Willard Owners Group. I would
consider an annual fee or the selling of Willard swag as a way to
support the enterprise. It would be a shame to loose any archived
data.
Les
W30 Searcher, Molly Dog
Stockton, Ca

On Sep 9, 2020, at 07:33, Gary Mertl via groups.io
<gulliver32us=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the
group.
Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA
On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via
groups.io <pete_pisc=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO.
Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus
credit card processing fees). Our choices are:
1. CONTINUE ON GROUPS.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some
sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations.
It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the
Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a
shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. LET THE GROUPS.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to
an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be
lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to
Groups.IO
3. MOVE TO A DIFFERENT PLATFORM. If anyone has some better ideas,
I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a
Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep
in the family.
4. SELL SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we
had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But
that would take some work and someone would have to hold the
inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner
with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned.
Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?
Peter
--
-------------------------
M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40
Ensenada, MX
--
Gary
W30 Voyager, _ORCA_
Bellingham, WA
--
Les H.
1973 Searcher, Molly Dog, Stockton,Ca
--
-------------------------
M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40
Ensenada, MX
--
Sean Eamon Kennedy
Vega Voyager "Moonlight"
Links:
------
[1] https://WillardBoatOwners.groups.io/g/main/message/18119
[2] https://groups.io/mt/76729437/2270402
[3] https://WillardBoatOwners.groups.io/g/main/post
[4] https://WillardBoatOwners.groups.io/g/main/editsub/2270402
[5] https://WillardBoatOwners.groups.io/g/main/leave/defanged


Rick E
 

Thanks Peter for getting the discussion going. And you are also due a huge thanks for keeping “the List” going, even when the Yahoo Groups list was shut down. You paid for the first year of this new list, and also donated toward support of the WOG website. Major thanks!!

In response to your comments:

 1. Continuing with Groups.io is a definite YES. It has worked very well, and was able to transfer threads from the Yahoo list, which would be very difficult to do on any other platform. The cost is quite reasonable when spread out over members of the group. More about funding it below . . .

2. Reverting to email list only is no good - I don’t think anyone wants to give up the ability to go online to search through topics. As an email only list, the history is lost.

3. I’ve looked at a LOT of different platforms, including club membership sites, forums, website builders, etc. My website building experience has centered on Drupal/Backdrop, which is a very flexible content management system.  It can do a lot, but the more we pile on to it, the more complicated it gets to maintain. To reproduce the capabilities, and historical continuity, of the Groups.io list would take more work than I’m willing to put into it. There are some good club/membership platforms that could work well, but they tend to be pretty expensive.

4. Selling Swag: I have set up space on the willardboats.org site for selling Willard hats and burgees: https://willardboats.org/form/willard-branded-stuff
and have a new supply of each arriving soon, so can take orders now. I’ve set donations a bit above cost with shipping, so can use the extra to pay for both the Groups.io list and the willardboats.org site. Donation payments go into my Paypal account for Willard donations. I will be providing an accounting page on the WOG site, where members can see the current balance, as well as the outlays for websites, etc.  If we get in the red at any point, we can make a pitch for additional donations. 

The same PayPal account can be used to pay for the WBO List. As we get close to the expiration date, we can make a call for donations to cover it. (Note: The account is a Paypal account, but it accepts payment from any major credit card - there is no need to have a Paypal account yourself in order to make a payment there.)

Regarding the problem of having two “sites” for Willard boats, they are not two competing sites, but are complementary.  I think the WOG website is important as a repository of photos and information about Willards in general, as well as specific details and histories of each boat, which cannot be done with an email list. And the WBO List is something that becomes very complicated within a website platform. One of the main reasons is that the WOG can be hosted on an inexpensive shared server, but when large bulk emails are going out from it, they tend to get branded as spam, so you need to upgrade the site to a much more expensive server, and then deal with all the hassles of email protocols, etc. So for the forum, Groups.io is a great solution.

Bottom line is that my vote is to continue basically as we are, with the WOG site as the “front page” for Willard boats - the place where people who are curious first come to find out about Willards. Owners can sign on there, and have access to contact information about other owners, can purchase WIllard stuff, etc. The Forum link there will then take people to the WBO list site. Of course, folks have to register and login separately to each site, but once done on a private computer, the logins can be saved, so it becomes relatively seamless to go back and forth.

At this point I’m willing to continue maintaining the WOG site, and being an admin on the WBO list. (Being admin on both sites also allows me to sign members up to both sites from one email request.)

I’m also able to keep up with the donations and merchandise ordering and distribution for now, but would love to find someone else willing to be the “store manager/bookkeeper”!


--
Rick E., WOG and WBO Admin
willardboats.org


Richard A. Miller
 

I would like to see WBO hook up with Rick Etsell’s site, and a plan for succession management, with contributions solicited from participants/members and any surplus reserved for future operating expenses.

Many, many thanks for your invaluable service to this Site through the years, Peter, and for Rick’s devoted service as well.

Richard Miller
WBO Member since about 1999.
Willard 30 Voyager Seagull and 
Willard 40 Flybridge Sedan Adria

On Sep 9, 2020, at 5:35 AM, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:

Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX


Richard A. Miller
 

Swag is okay too but requires a whole additional level of administration snd management and purchasing errors can be costly.  You have to recover entire investment in inventory before you make any profit.
Richard Miller

On Sep 9, 2020, at 5:35 AM, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:

Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX


Sven
 

On Wed, Sep 9, 2020 at 03:35 AM, Peter P wrote:
Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:
Nancy and I will of course be happy to contribute again.  Same address as last year ?


-Sven & Nancy


Richard A. Miller
 

I second the motion , Rick, i.e. support your comments wholeheartedly.
Richard Miller 

On Sep 9, 2020, at 10:44 AM, Rick E <rick@...> wrote:

Thanks Peter for getting the discussion going. And you are also due a huge thanks for keeping “the List” going, even when the Yahoo Groups list was shut down. You paid for the first year of this new list, and also donated toward support of the WOG website. Major thanks!!

In response to your comments:

 1. Continuing with Groups.io is a definite YES. It has worked very well, and was able to transfer threads from the Yahoo list, which would be very difficult to do on any other platform. The cost is quite reasonable when spread out over members of the group. More about funding it below . . .

2. Reverting to email list only is no good - I don’t think anyone wants to give up the ability to go online to search through topics. As an email only list, the history is lost.

3. I’ve looked at a LOT of different platforms, including club membership sites, forums, website builders, etc. My website building experience has centered on Drupal/Backdrop, which is a very flexible content management system.  It can do a lot, but the more we pile on to it, the more complicated it gets to maintain. To reproduce the capabilities, and historical continuity, of the Groups.io list would take more work than I’m willing to put into it. There are some good club/membership platforms that could work well, but they tend to be pretty expensive.

4. Selling Swag: I have set up space on the willardboats.org site for selling Willard hats and burgees: https://willardboats.org/form/willard-branded-stuff
and have a new supply of each arriving soon, so can take orders now. I’ve set donations a bit above cost with shipping, so can use the extra to pay for both the Groups.io list and the willardboats.org site. Donation payments go into my Paypal account for Willard donations. I will be providing an accounting page on the WOG site, where members can see the current balance, as well as the outlays for websites, etc.  If we get in the red at any point, we can make a pitch for additional donations. 

The same PayPal account can be used to pay for the WBO List. As we get close to the expiration date, we can make a call for donations to cover it. (Note: The account is a Paypal account, but it accepts payment from any major credit card - there is no need to have a Paypal account yourself in order to make a payment there.)

Regarding the problem of having two “sites” for Willard boats, they are not two competing sites, but are complementary.  I think the WOG website is important as a repository of photos and information about Willards in general, as well as specific details and histories of each boat, which cannot be done with an email list. And the WBO List is something that becomes very complicated within a website platform. One of the main reasons is that the WOG can be hosted on an inexpensive shared server, but when large bulk emails are going out from it, they tend to get branded as spam, so you need to upgrade the site to a much more expensive server, and then deal with all the hassles of email protocols, etc. So for the forum, Groups.io is a great solution.

Bottom line is that my vote is to continue basically as we are, with the WOG site as the “front page” for Willard boats - the place where people who are curious first come to find out about Willards. Owners can sign on there, and have access to contact information about other owners, can purchase WIllard stuff, etc. The Forum link there will then take people to the WBO list site. Of course, folks have to register and login separately to each site, but once done on a private computer, the logins can be saved, so it becomes relatively seamless to go back and forth.

At this point I’m willing to continue maintaining the WOG site, and being an admin on the WBO list. (Being admin on both sites also allows me to sign members up to both sites from one email request.)

I’m also able to keep up with the donations and merchandise ordering and distribution for now, but would love to find someone else willing to be the “store manager/bookkeeper”!


--
Rick E., WOG and WBO Admin
willardboats.org


Tony Edwaeds
 

An annual fee seems like the way to go... I’m in.

Tony
W40 Phoenix
Block Island, RI


On Sep 9, 2020, at 11:44 AM, Rick E <rick@...> wrote:

Thanks Peter for getting the discussion going. And you are also due a huge thanks for keeping “the List” going, even when the Yahoo Groups list was shut down. You paid for the first year of this new list, and also donated toward support of the WOG website. Major thanks!!

In response to your comments:

 1. Continuing with Groups.io is a definite YES. It has worked very well, and was able to transfer threads from the Yahoo list, which would be very difficult to do on any other platform. The cost is quite reasonable when spread out over members of the group. More about funding it below . . .

2. Reverting to email list only is no good - I don’t think anyone wants to give up the ability to go online to search through topics. As an email only list, the history is lost.

3. I’ve looked at a LOT of different platforms, including club membership sites, forums, website builders, etc. My website building experience has centered on Drupal/Backdrop, which is a very flexible content management system.  It can do a lot, but the more we pile on to it, the more complicated it gets to maintain. To reproduce the capabilities, and historical continuity, of the Groups.io list would take more work than I’m willing to put into it. There are some good club/membership platforms that could work well, but they tend to be pretty expensive.

4. Selling Swag: I have set up space on the willardboats.org site for selling Willard hats and burgees: https://willardboats.org/form/willard-branded-stuff
and have a new supply of each arriving soon, so can take orders now. I’ve set donations a bit above cost with shipping, so can use the extra to pay for both the Groups.io list and the willardboats.org site. Donation payments go into my Paypal account for Willard donations. I will be providing an accounting page on the WOG site, where members can see the current balance, as well as the outlays for websites, etc.  If we get in the red at any point, we can make a pitch for additional donations. 

The same PayPal account can be used to pay for the WBO List. As we get close to the expiration date, we can make a call for donations to cover it. (Note: The account is a Paypal account, but it accepts payment from any major credit card - there is no need to have a Paypal account yourself in order to make a payment there.)

Regarding the problem of having two “sites” for Willard boats, they are not two competing sites, but are complementary.  I think the WOG website is important as a repository of photos and information about Willards in general, as well as specific details and histories of each boat, which cannot be done with an email list. And the WBO List is something that becomes very complicated within a website platform. One of the main reasons is that the WOG can be hosted on an inexpensive shared server, but when large bulk emails are going out from it, they tend to get branded as spam, so you need to upgrade the site to a much more expensive server, and then deal with all the hassles of email protocols, etc. So for the forum, Groups.io is a great solution.

Bottom line is that my vote is to continue basically as we are, with the WOG site as the “front page” for Willard boats - the place where people who are curious first come to find out about Willards. Owners can sign on there, and have access to contact information about other owners, can purchase WIllard stuff, etc. The Forum link there will then take people to the WBO list site. Of course, folks have to register and login separately to each site, but once done on a private computer, the logins can be saved, so it becomes relatively seamless to go back and forth.

At this point I’m willing to continue maintaining the WOG site, and being an admin on the WBO list. (Being admin on both sites also allows me to sign members up to both sites from one email request.)

I’m also able to keep up with the donations and merchandise ordering and distribution for now, but would love to find someone else willing to be the “store manager/bookkeeper”!


--
Rick E., WOG and WBO Admin
willardboats.org


Lennie Cantor
 

I also would be willing to donate and or support a membership fee...

Lennie

On Sep 9, 2020, at 5:30 AM, Sean Eamon Kennedy via groups.io <s_eamon_k@...> wrote:


Thank you Rick! We don’t say that enough, especially if we don’t get to get to see you at a rendezvous. 

I rather like groups.io. Having just one site on the WillardBoats.org would be nice, but I suspect it would be a lot of work to get it up to the same functionality as groups.io. 

What do you all think of formalizing the group somewhat and having an annual membership fee that supports both groups.io and the willardboats.org sites. Any excess could be used to help subsidize the annual rendezvous. A bet $10/year would be plenty - too much if all 343 current groups.io members paid up!

We’d need to incorporate as a non-profit, but I’d be willing to help with that. 

I really do appreciate all the knowledge the group has and shares. Let’s keep it going. 



On Sep 9, 2020, at 8:03 AM, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Les - I believe the second Group on WillardBoats.org was setup by Rick when we weren't sure what our future looked like when Yahoo shut down last year. Rick has done an amazing job of keeping WBO together these last couple of years.


Peter Pisciotta 
+1-408-772-1564 (WhatsApp/Text/Mobile)


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 10:37:41 AM EDT, Les Higgins via groups.io <almonhiggins@...> wrote:


It is interesting that there are two groups? Why is that?  It seems that we should have a combined Willard Owners Group. I would consider an annual fee or the selling of Willard swag as a way to support the enterprise. It would be a shame to loose any archived data.
Les
W30 Searcher, Molly Dog
Stockton, Ca


On Sep 9, 2020, at 07:33, Gary Mertl via groups.io <gulliver32us@...> wrote:


I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA

--
Les H.

1973 Searcher, Molly Dog, Stockton,Ca 


--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Sean Eamon Kennedy
Vega Voyager “Moonlight”


Daron Toll
 

I also would be willing to donate
Daron Toll
Vega 36


On Sep 9, 2020, at 10:34 AM, Lennie Cantor via groups.io <cantleo@...> wrote:

I also would be willing to donate and or support a membership fee...

Lennie

On Sep 9, 2020, at 5:30 AM, Sean Eamon Kennedy via groups.io <s_eamon_k@...> wrote:


Thank you Rick! We don’t say that enough, especially if we don’t get to get to see you at a rendezvous. 

I rather like groups.io. Having just one site on the WillardBoats.org would be nice, but I suspect it would be a lot of work to get it up to the same functionality as groups.io. 

What do you all think of formalizing the group somewhat and having an annual membership fee that supports both groups.io and the willardboats.org sites. Any excess could be used to help subsidize the annual rendezvous. A bet $10/year would be plenty - too much if all 343 current groups.io members paid up!

We’d need to incorporate as a non-profit, but I’d be willing to help with that. 

I really do appreciate all the knowledge the group has and shares. Let’s keep it going. 



On Sep 9, 2020, at 8:03 AM, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Les - I believe the second Group on WillardBoats.org was setup by Rick when we weren't sure what our future looked like when Yahoo shut down last year. Rick has done an amazing job of keeping WBO together these last couple of years.


Peter Pisciotta 
+1-408-772-1564 (WhatsApp/Text/Mobile)


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 10:37:41 AM EDT, Les Higgins via groups.io <almonhiggins@...> wrote:


It is interesting that there are two groups? Why is that?  It seems that we should have a combined Willard Owners Group. I would consider an annual fee or the selling of Willard swag as a way to support the enterprise. It would be a shame to loose any archived data.
Les
W30 Searcher, Molly Dog
Stockton, Ca


On Sep 9, 2020, at 07:33, Gary Mertl via groups.io <gulliver32us@...> wrote:


I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA

--
Les H.

1973 Searcher, Molly Dog, Stockton,Ca 


--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Sean Eamon Kennedy
Vega Voyager “Moonlight”

--
Vega 36 “Little Willy”


Jim Nuccio
 

Peter - thanks for taking the lead on this and all associated effort. I’d certainly support continuation with the IO group with a donation. 

Thanks,

Jim




On Sep 9, 2020, at 6:35 AM, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:

Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Jim N
W30 Searcher, Dulcinea
Manasquan, NJ


JB
 

I am only a wannabe Willard group troll who jealously follows the posting here, but would gladly contribute to creation and maintenance of a group site.  PayPal or Venmo would be convenient.
Good luck... Joe


On Sep 9, 2020, at 10:26 AM, Gary Mertl via groups.io <gulliver32us@...> wrote:


I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA


Robert Green
 

Peter,  You can count me in on contributions too.

Bob Green ,  30' Searcher,Hank

On 09/09/2020 12:23 PM Daron Toll via groups.io <darontoll@...> wrote:


I also would be willing to donate
Daron Toll
Vega 36



On Sep 9, 2020, at 10:34 AM, Lennie Cantor via groups.io <cantleo@...> wrote:

I also would be willing to donate and or support a membership fee...

Lennie

On Sep 9, 2020, at 5:30 AM, Sean Eamon Kennedy via groups.io <s_eamon_k@...> wrote:

Thank you Rick! We don’t say that enough, especially if we don’t get to get to see you at a rendezvous. 

I rather like groups.io. Having just one site on the WillardBoats.org would be nice, but I suspect it would be a lot of work to get it up to the same functionality as groups.io. 

What do you all think of formalizing the group somewhat and having an annual membership fee that supports both groups.io and the willardboats.org sites. Any excess could be used to help subsidize the annual rendezvous. A bet $10/year would be plenty - too much if all 343 current groups.io members paid up!

We’d need to incorporate as a non-profit, but I’d be willing to help with that. 

I really do appreciate all the knowledge the group has and shares. Let’s keep it going. 



On Sep 9, 2020, at 8:03 AM, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:

Les - I believe the second Group on WillardBoats.org was setup by Rick when we weren't sure what our future looked like when Yahoo shut down last year. Rick has done an amazing job of keeping WBO together these last couple of years.


Peter Pisciotta 
+1-408-772-1564 (WhatsApp/Text/Mobile)


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 10:37:41 AM EDT, Les Higgins via groups.io <almonhiggins@...> wrote:


It is interesting that there are two groups? Why is that?  It seems that we should have a combined Willard Owners Group. I would consider an annual fee or the selling of Willard swag as a way to support the enterprise. It would be a shame to loose any archived data.
Les
W30 Searcher, Molly Dog
Stockton, Ca



On Sep 9, 2020, at 07:33, Gary Mertl via groups.io <gulliver32us@...> wrote:

I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA

--
Les H.

1973 Searcher, Molly Dog, Stockton,Ca 


--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Sean Eamon Kennedy
Vega Voyager “Moonlight”

--
Vega 36 “Little Willy”


Michael Nachlinger
 

Peter and Rick,

Would be glad to help fill the Fedora.  Would also like to buy a burgee for the Yacht Club's wall.


Michael Nachlinger

San Juan Island Yacht Club



On 9/9/20 12:52 PM, Robert Green wrote:
Peter,  You can count me in on contributions too.

Bob Green ,  30' Searcher,Hank
On 09/09/2020 12:23 PM Daron Toll via groups.io <darontoll@...> wrote:


I also would be willing to donate
Daron Toll
Vega 36



On Sep 9, 2020, at 10:34 AM, Lennie Cantor via groups.io <cantleo@...> wrote:

I also would be willing to donate and or support a membership fee...

Lennie

On Sep 9, 2020, at 5:30 AM, Sean Eamon Kennedy via groups.io <s_eamon_k@...> wrote:

Thank you Rick! We don’t say that enough, especially if we don’t get to get to see you at a rendezvous. 

I rather like groups.io. Having just one site on the WillardBoats.org would be nice, but I suspect it would be a lot of work to get it up to the same functionality as groups.io. 

What do you all think of formalizing the group somewhat and having an annual membership fee that supports both groups.io and the willardboats.org sites. Any excess could be used to help subsidize the annual rendezvous. A bet $10/year would be plenty - too much if all 343 current groups.io members paid up!

We’d need to incorporate as a non-profit, but I’d be willing to help with that. 

I really do appreciate all the knowledge the group has and shares. Let’s keep it going. 



On Sep 9, 2020, at 8:03 AM, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:

Les - I believe the second Group on WillardBoats.org was setup by Rick when we weren't sure what our future looked like when Yahoo shut down last year. Rick has done an amazing job of keeping WBO together these last couple of years.


Peter Pisciotta 
+1-408-772-1564 (WhatsApp/Text/Mobile)


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 10:37:41 AM EDT, Les Higgins via groups.io <almonhiggins@...> wrote:


It is interesting that there are two groups? Why is that?  It seems that we should have a combined Willard Owners Group. I would consider an annual fee or the selling of Willard swag as a way to support the enterprise. It would be a shame to loose any archived data.
Les
W30 Searcher, Molly Dog
Stockton, Ca



On Sep 9, 2020, at 07:33, Gary Mertl via groups.io <gulliver32us@...> wrote:

I'd be happy to donate to whatever platform seems best to the group.

Gary
W30 Voyager, Orca
Bellingham, WA


On Wednesday, September 9, 2020, 03:35:34 AM PDT, Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...> wrote:


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Gary
W30 Voyager, ORCA
Bellingham, WA

--
Les H.

1973 Searcher, Molly Dog, Stockton,Ca 


--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Sean Eamon Kennedy
Vega Voyager “Moonlight”

--
Vega 36 “Little Willy”


William Smith
 

We would be happy to chip in. Thanks for all the work you do.

Bill and Kathy Smith
Dubhe
Willard 30 Nomad


-----Original Message-----
From: Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...>
To: main <main@WillardBoatOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Wed, Sep 9, 2020 06:35 AM
Subject: [WillardBoatOwners] WBO - SOON: Pass-the-Hat to fund the Site


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Bill and Kathy Smith
Dubhe
Willard 30 Nomad


ALAN LAVINE seaVocean
 

I'm In

SeaVocean@... 

On Sep 9, 2020 3:03 PM, "William Smith via groups.io" <vtupelohoney@...> wrote:
We would be happy to chip in. Thanks for all the work you do.

Bill and Kathy Smith
Dubhe
Willard 30 Nomad


-----Original Message-----
From: Peter P via groups.io <pete_pisc@...>
To: main <main@WillardBoatOwners.groups.io>
Sent: Wed, Sep 9, 2020 06:35 AM
Subject: [WillardBoatOwners] WBO - SOON: Pass-the-Hat to fund the Site


Next month will mark the 1-year anniversary of WBO on Groups.IO. Groups.IO is a fee-based service which will cost $220/year (plus credit card processing fees). Our choices are:

1. Continue on Groups.IO with Donation Request. Groups.IO has some sort of partnership with a firm where we can accept donations. It's a bit of a hassle as the money goes to me, then I pay the Groups.IO fee. Not sure what happens if there an overage or a shortfall. I assume I can return all money, but am not sure.
2. Let the Groups.IO Subscription expire. Appears we would go to an email-only group. All files, photos, and archives would be lost. This is the service Yahoo! reverted to that drove us to Groups.IO
3. Move to a different platform. If anyone has some better ideas, I'm all ears. I see WillardBoats.Org (Rick Etsell's admin) has a Forum function. This would still take some funding, but would keep in the family. 
4. Sell SWAG. Recent thread on burgees got me thinking that if we had some trinkets to sell, we could probably fund the site. But that would take some work and someone would have to hold the inventory, as well as shipping. Might be a good way to partner with WillardBoats.org as our interests and expenses are aligned. 

Thoughts? Feedback? Ideas?

Peter
--

M/V Weebles
1970 Willard 36 Sedan Hull #40

Ensenada, MX

--
Bill and Kathy Smith
Dubhe
Willard 30 Nomad